There's honestly no point to having an admin recommend you as if an admin recommends you, you already are on track to having your application approved. They may as well vouch when the application is released instead of offering their recommendation.
Remove admin recommendations.
Please Note: The TotalFreedom Forum has now been put into a read-only mode. Total Freedom has now closed down and will not be returning in any way, shape or form. It has been a pleasure to lead this community and I wish you all the best for your futures.
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admin recommendations really are just a barrier so that 50 ops don't apply, and that their actions were recognised
vouch as thats really what its only used for and bias usually is the case
also rec requests are dumb -
on one hand, i feel this this is a necessary barrier to prevent influx's of denied applications. they have their place.
on the other i feel like it is difficult to get a valid rec for helping out in game. to get rec's you are better off trying to get along with admins these days (admittedly as much as i hate to say this, i feel like this was where most of my recs came from because i blew up the server last year but hey, least i can do is put on a decent show right??),
i mean i would be more down to reform the rec system rather then outright remove them and let everyone apply when they feel like it. not that i have any clue you'd reform it. i mean the only thing that comes to mind is that if admin officer gang run training sessions once a month and for them to decide if they're ready or not. apart from that i have no fucking clue
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Vouch for a reform of the system. I didn't say this at first in case I'd get thrown under the bus, but it's true that nowadays you have to be friends with admins to get recommendations.
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@lyicx#5458
That's correct, but please do think about how if there really was an influx of denied applications. Many of the inexperienced ops would apply anyway regardless if they meet the requirements or not. I'm not in favor of going head and head with you as this is just a suggestion and it's up to how the community perceives it. -
I believe that removing recommendations does not fit within the current system. If we are going to do a complete overhaul, we might not want to remove them because they could become more meaningful in new system. It's not really possible to discuss that without having a draft version of such an overhaul.
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Vouch.
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Do not start a "training" system for admins. it doesn't work and has shown to be a massive failure multiple times in the past.
You do not really need to reform the recommendation system either. Its their for literally the bare minimum.
Rarely any applicant is going to get recommendations based off their performance in game. You cannot possibly expect admins to be unbiased, and rec only based on who is the most qualified. I do not see admins rec'ing their friends as a problem, as literally you could assign an ape to be a super admin and they would do a half decent job.
Point being, overhauling it is useless, and making it anything more than it already is will lead to further incompetency and biasness. Removing it is also quite useless. If a person cannot get the 2? required recs then yeah i honestly think they have no business being an admin considering how easy it is.
If you want to actually have a decent recommendation system, then make the people who recommended liable for the people they recommend. People would definitely be more weary of just giving them away. I do not, however, think this is at all necessary.
Remove them or leave them alone. Anything else further complicates it and is not worth it. There's not an admin quality problem, and if there is overhauling the rec system is not the solution. Besides, historically super admin has always been a quantity > quality system.
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object.
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Object
I think getting recommended is a necessary part of applying for admin, and if we didn’t have it a ton of people would just suddenly apply.
it also helps recognize extra helpful players over normal players.
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@UnderTails#6084 what are you basing this on? Why would people just suddenly apply in droves. Got anything to affirm this belief besides intuition?
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@Miwojedk#6134 because if there is no need for getting recommended there will be virtually no requirements for becoming admin other than the 1 month forum membership.
And any just average player would be able to apply for admin when they really aren’t fit for the position.
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I object, I feel like it is an inital barrier to entry that provides some type of filter. If you cannot get a single recommendation you probably wouldn't do well as an admin.
The whole application system is likely due for an overhaul anyway.
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Object, see above post
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object cause if this was approved, the next day ill probably see your admin application
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@UnderTails#6151
Quote"Got anything to affirm this belief besides intuition?"
Having a recommendation nowadays is simply a redundant barrier to entry when you already need to have a forum account for 30 days in order to apply. If somebody unfit were to apply for Admin, then their applicaton would be denied due to a majority of objections - therefore having this system in place is nothing more than useless optics. I very much doubt that removing this useless barrier would result in an increase in Admin applicants, which is why I asked you to supply me with something that counters this notion.
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Vouch
Currently, the system is extremely confusing. I get asked a lot on what a recommendation actually is. There have been many admin applications posting "fake recommendations" that they thought were valid, but ended up getting confused if a said admin actually recommended them.
Most recommendations for successful admins are given after an application is created in the first place. Post application usually requires the player to post a recommendation thread if they want a recommendation, which seems unnecessary and more of a "I'm applying for admin soon." scheme. The only time you wouldn't have to do this is if you are friends with admins that recommended you. The application itself seems like enough of a determining factor to find out if a player is fit for admin.
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Quote
@Captainclimber#6217 Object
do you mean vouch?
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So this is something I'm already considering, and potentially not removing admin recommendations but ultimately changing their purpose.
I agree having it as a bar to entry is frankly stupid and in reality just de values a recommendation but more work needs to be done to move to a more effective system overall.
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fionn Any thoughts?
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